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On 11/1/2019 at 2:11 PM, rpm72x said:

Better product, better support, better service, better pricing....

That's all? There has to be more to it than that...............  😀

I still think it would be better for the sport  if there was more/better competition for the bicknell's.

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1 hour ago, chas71 said:

That's all? There has to be more to it than that...............  😀

I still think it would be better for the sport  if there was more/better competition for the bicknell's.

I agree but that falls on the other builders...it’s up to them to get guys in their cars and help them win....sometimes that means finding the correct driver and  basically giving them cars or having a house car. There are ppl that blame the teams like HBR for switching when in reality it’s not their responsibility to spend a bunch of money and be test dummies. Building the correct relationships with drivers may cost a little at this point, but could pay huge dividends. Years back Integra hooked themselves to decker, fuller and Sheppard....who all would win with any shock, and now they dominate the modified market. Their shocks are certainly not the best available, but when you have the best guys on them everyone has to follow suit. Torsion bar companies, coil spring companies, rod ends...etc all do the same thing.  

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1 hour ago, Sicklajoie said:

That was for the STSS race, not the 200.

I think the entire top 10 for ES 200 was Bicknell, except for Billy Dunn in 9th. Polesitter Max McLaughlin was in a Teo.

 

Your right my bad I apologize....

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I didn't realize it was that lopsided toward Bicknell So quest is; why aren't other brands more equal?And are bicks built here or Canada?

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1 hour ago, zzz said:

I didn't realize it was that lopsided toward Bicknell So quest is; why aren't other brands more equal?And are bicks built here or Canada?

Built in Canada.

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3 hours ago, zzz said:

I didn't realize it was that lopsided toward Bicknell So quest is; why aren't other brands more equal?And are bicks built here or Canada?

Tubing location, tubing thickness (where they are not mandated), welding/manufacturing process, pick points, flex ability, overall design. These all play large factors. Having most of the best talent helps as well. Everyone saw what Sheppard did with a troyer, what they didn’t see were the hours and hours spent redesigning the troyer to be more like his bicknells. Matt is extremely smart, and a damn good fabricator, it took him most of that first season with troyers to get them where he liked them, and his 1st shot at buying his own cars, he went straight back to bicknell. 

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2 hours ago, DIRTCar97 said:

Built in Canada.

Now they are, but the 1st one was built in New Jersey by Hearn.....LOL

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On 11/1/2019 at 11:57 PM, rpm72x said:

I do think the fit and finish, along with the design of the bodies on both the teos and troyers are far nicer than the bicknell. Some parts of the bicknell bodies look unfinished, or like they are an afterthought. 

Don’t confuse the Bicknell Bodies with the Aftermarket bodies put on the Bicknell Chassis

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BICKNELL SUPPORT MASTERMIND

🏁RANDY WILLIAMSON🏁

YES FATHER OF 🏁MAT WILLIAMSON🏁

And Don’t forget MR SMALLBLOCK PETE BICKNELL  HIMSELF WHO CONTINUES TO TEST AND APROVE AND IMPROVE THE PRODUCTS OF HIS NAME🏁

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22 hours ago, rpm72x said:

I agree but that falls on the other builders...it’s up to them to get guys in their cars and help them win....sometimes that means finding the correct driver and  basically giving them cars or having a house car. There are ppl that blame the teams like HBR for switching when in reality it’s not their responsibility to spend a bunch of money and be test dummies. Building the correct relationships with drivers may cost a little at this point, but could pay huge dividends. Years back Integra hooked themselves to decker, fuller and Sheppard....who all would win with any shock, and now they dominate the modified market. Their shocks are certainly not the best available, but when you have the best guys on them everyone has to follow suit. Torsion bar companies, coil spring companies, rod ends...etc all do the same thing.  

Nobody’s shocks are box stock, the brand itself doesn’t mean a whole lot. 

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25 minutes ago, Josh Bayko said:

Nobody’s shocks are box stock, the brand itself doesn’t mean a whole lot. 

To a point yes, but the bodies wear extremely fast on the integras, causing bleed on both sides of the piston....the shim stacks/build sheets are extremely inconsistent. You can build 3 rr med dig(for example)shocks with the same exact stacks and dyno all 3, they will all be different. You will not see that with a Penske, bilstein or fox shock.The face shims do not hold up to rough tracks well. Rebuilds are required more frequently.They have maxima produce their oil which is middle of the road at best...they are a mid grade shock, but have the majority of the teams on them because of names on deals. What they do have is the best selection of “box stock” shocks....they have some really good packages that you can walk into Scott Jeffrey’s and buy and not have to be valved.  Many of the other brands stick to plain Jane linear packages for “out of box” applications. 

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29 minutes ago, Fran said:

Don’t confuse the Bicknell Bodies with the Aftermarket bodies put on the Bicknell Chassis

Some aftermarket bicknell bodies are nicer than factory, imo the Teo and troyers have nicer bodies, unfortunately for them, bodies don’t win races....

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10 minutes ago, rpm72x said:

To a point yes, but the bodies wear extremely fast on the integras, causing bleed on both sides of the piston....the shim stacks/build sheets are extremely inconsistent. You can build 3 rr med dig(for example)shocks with the same exact stacks and dyno all 3, they will all be different. You will not see that with a Penske, bilstein or fox shock.The face shims do not hold up to rough tracks well. Rebuilds are required more frequently.They have maxima produce their oil which is middle of the road at best...they are a mid grade shock, but have the majority of the teams on them because of names on deals. What they do have is the best selection of “box stock” shocks....they have some really good packages that you can walk into Scott Jeffrey’s and buy and not have to be valved.  Many of the other brands stick to plain Jane linear packages for “out of box” applications. 

The easiest way to get the nicest Integras is to get friendly with Mr. Daugherty. 

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1 minute ago, Josh Bayko said:

The easiest way to get the nicest Integras is to get friendly with Mr. Daugherty. 

That may be true, but the body anodizing is the same. The shims are the same, the rod guides and seals are the same. I’ve built shocks for racecars, motorcycles, snowmobiles and street rods....probably the highest quality product out there are the Penske, genesis and the ohlins....they all build modified stuff but are nowhere near as popular because of the marketing put forth by those companies here. Crazy part is, still at this time our modified technology is stuff that was being used on snowmobiles over 25 years ago. 

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24 minutes ago, Eagleonemotorsports said:

Rpm

do you realize how many shock companies Maxima builds shock oils for? 

Of course he knows that. He knows everything....

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1 hour ago, Eagleonemotorsports said:

Rpm

do you realize how many shock companies Maxima builds shock oils for? 

Maxima builds a lot of different oil for a lot of companies and applications, the std integra 3 weight is ok, nothing special. 

 

1 hour ago, Mike Coleates said:

Of course he knows that. He knows everything....

I’ve forgotten more about dirt modifieds than most of the beer booth bandits on here will ever know. Pick any shock guys that are not hooked to a certain brand and ask them to fact check me, I’ll be correct. Oh and ask just about anyone actually involved in dirt modified racing in regards to the chassis conversation we have had, fact check again, you will find more of the same. 

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I’ve answered questions with facts not opinions or bullshit, I’ve built and assembled a lot of racecars from each manufacturer, and while I do shocks solely for some side money, I still do about 100 or more of them a year. I have 15-20k worth of dynos in my garage.  I’m very happy that your going to educated all of us with your inside knowledge Mike C. I’m always up for learning something new, it will be quite a change from most of this forum, as it usually supplies laughter instead of knowledge. 

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10 minutes ago, rpm72x said:

I’ve answered questions with facts not opinions or bullshit, I’ve built and assembled a lot of racecars from each manufacturer, and while I do shocks solely for some side money, I still do about 100 or more of them a year. I have 15-20k worth of dynos in my garage.  I’m very happy that your going to educated all of us with your inside knowledge Mike C. I’m always up for learning something new, it will be quite a change from most of this forum, as it usually supplies laughter instead of knowledge. 

I never said I was going to educate anyone. You’re the expert on every topic here. I just can’t believe that you don’t own THE best dirt track,THE best chassis,THE best shock,spring,rear end or engine building facility. I mean your an expert on everything. 

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Anybody else remember when Matt Sheppard first went to HBR after Brownell?

How many posted on here that Matt would not win nearly as many races in a Troyer car? 

how any did he win that year ? ?   :o

its not all about the manufacturer 

its the people in the shop each day

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19 minutes ago, Mike Coleates said:

I never said I was going to educate anyone. You’re the expert on every topic here. I just can’t believe that you don’t own THE best dirt track,THE best chassis,THE best shock,spring,rear end or engine building facility. I mean your an expert on everything. 

So when a discussion is started on here about chassis and suspension, instead of answering questions or having input based on actual knowledge and experience, you do your best at being an ass to ppl who do? So basically you have no knowledge in regards to this thread, and it upsets you that I do. Go get your hands dirty and try to learn something. You will feel more involved with everything related to racing. As far as having the best of everything, I have a lot of very nice things I waste money on, I’ve wasted hundreds of thousands on racecars, a racetrack is nothing I care to own. I am however an expert on spotting someone who is not overly knowledgeable with racecars, and you my friend, fit the mold.

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4 minutes ago, leroy said:

Anybody else remember when Matt Sheppard first went to HBR after Brownell?

How many posted on here that Matt would not win nearly as many races in a Troyer car? 

how any did he win that year ? ?   :o

its not all about the manufacturer 

its the people in the shop each day

He won plenty, especially after he re designed much of the car. I don’t know for sure but I believe year 2 of HBR he won 27 races, each year since leaving he has averaged about 45, so no he didn’t win anywhere near as much. 

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22 minutes ago, Eagleonemotorsports said:

If you also remember HBR had their own motor program and still do today far as I know. I think the bigger asset it drive ability of the motor combos

They use Bob bruneau engines out of Bristol Connecticut. He has built engines for almost everything involved in racing including nascar.  They have used Bob for years....when matt came I believe they actually purchased his favorite cc motor from brownell and he used both. Morrison had built the open small blocks they had for the roc stuff years back and fingerlakes did some work as well, Doug built all of Jimmys engines forever with his family team.

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