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I've seen the sticks used at East Bay in the LOLMS a few weeks back. At the time I didn't think much of it. But after reading the article on the front page I think it's the same as using radios. And  now I realized that Max changing lanes on the last lap and blocking Decker wasn't just a lucky move. It was a very ugly last second lane change. I thought Max just messed up, but now it makes sense why he changed his lane at that particular point and why it looked so ugly.  If I hadn't read that article  I would of been none the wiser. I felt really disappointed for Billy Decker, that should of been the move of the race. But it wasn't just dumb luck, it was a cheap last second block. If they weren't using "sticks" Decker just "might" of pulled that move off. Instead he had to check up and settle for second and the fans were robbed of what could of been an exciting ending. All because teams are now skirting around the no radios rule. This was one of the reason they banned radios from these races in the first place. And I don't agree that it can't be stomped out quickly. Part of the excitement is the leader not knowing what is going on behind him. He has to use his intuition, hearing, and knowledge to keep the lead. Yes most the time you are a sitting duck. But its your job to counter as soon as you can. 

I know teams use to use signs to communicate with drivers. But the "sticks" and the different motions they use give them so much more information. To me it's the same as using radios. Let the damn drivers DRIVE. That is what it's suppose to be about. This is just another tool to use to help drivers block each other and take away the actual "racing" out of the hands of the drivers. If they won't ban it, then just find an area on the track that all these "stick" holding people have to stand together at, and make them all use the exact same sticks. See if the driver can tell which sticks are his. If you feel your driver needs help driving the race car and you have to give him signals all the time. Then maybe he shouldn't be on the dame track in the first place.

I understand radios in NASCAR with the much larger tracks and much faster speeds, especially on Super Speedways. Its actually a safer with radios. But you don't need radios or someone signaling you on a short track dirt race. It should be in the hands of the drivers not some jackass standing there giving you signals on how to block someone.

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Teams having someone standing in a certain spot to signal their driver is nothing new, it has been going on for many years. Maybe using something like a stick is to tell someone to block is a bit extreme. 

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May as well let them use radios so they ain't taking there eyes off where they going. Radios probably safer so there ain't a last second move that's more than likely to cause a wreck. Although that tends to not pan out in Nascar. Speeds are higher though. 

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17 minutes ago, dan dan said:

May as well let them use radios so they ain't taking there eyes off where they going. Radios probably safer so there ain't a last second move that's more than likely to cause a wreck. Although that tends to not pan out in Nascar. Speeds are higher though. 

Sorry, but the last thing we need are radios. Teaches you to race farther than your radiator cap.

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My opinion is that if you're going to let them use sticks, you might as well let them run radios.  Sticks are a "cheaper" alternative, but the end result is the same.

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I think I only have a real problem with it if the guy with the sticks is standing down along the fence in front of where I sit .  Blocking my view.  It has happened a couple times.  
 
When you really think about it .  Spectators not allowed near fence at most venues due to safety. So,,,,,   Crew guys should not be there either 

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1 hour ago, Josh Bayko said:

Sticks have been used for years. This isn’t anything new. I don’t know why it’s supposed to be an issue now. 

In late models yes, they have been around for a long time, but not necessarily in Modifieds, especially in the Northeast and on the Super DIRTcar Series or Short Track Super Series.

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1 hour ago, FondaFan16 said:

In late models yes, they have been around for a long time, but not necessarily in Modifieds, especially in the Northeast and on the Super DIRTcar Series or Short Track Super Series.

They’ve been using out here even in mods since the radios went away, and I suspect it’s the same up in NY. 
 

This idea that he drivers see them every lap is laughable as well. 

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25 minutes ago, Josh Bayko said:

They’ve been using out here even in mods since the radios went away, and I suspect it’s the same up in NY. 
 

This idea that he drivers see them every lap is laughable as well. 

Josh:

Who was the first late model driver to use sticks in a race and at what track?

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12 minutes ago, scottnorwood said:

Josh:

Who was the first late model driver to use sticks in a race and at what track?

Beats me. It’s been going on since I was cognizant of what was going on. Went away for a while when radios made its way into the sport and returned when the radios went away. 

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7 hours ago, FondaFan16 said:

My opinion is that if you're going to let them use sticks, you might as well let them run radios.  Sticks are a "cheaper" alternative, but the end result is the same.

Not sure I agree. There's a difference between getting feedback once a lap and constant feedback. I don't think there should be radio's at all and I'm not a fan of sticks but not sure how you could police it.  We've talked about this and if they outlawed sticks, you could have someone face you indicating top, with their back turned indicating bottom, etc.  And I'm sure there are more novel ideas.

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No joke, this has been going on since I’ve started working on cars around 25 years ago. I would suspect it’s been going on much, much longer than that. The size, style and colors of the “sticks” have morphed over the years, and they get out of control at times but it is what it is. I assure you it has cost more guys races than it’s won for them. Every once in a while a cool guy that’s never even changed the oil on their street car figures out what they’re seeing and makes a stink about it, but I promise it doesn’t affect your viewing experience. Just enjoy the races and let the teams do their thing.

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While I don’t believe there are a lot of tracks that team members can be seen well enough get an advantage......In not a huge fan of any advantage gained by someone instructing you from outside the car, especially in typical weekly racing. With that said, crew members have been making themselves visible under caution and telling guys the better line for years, where I think it sucks is if you can see the crew guy and sticks well enough under green to make a Different decision in the car. 

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There’s some huge advantages to starting or being out front.....and sometimes your a sitting duck because you don’t know a different line is working. That’s part of the excitement short track racing brings.....and yet again people support something that can severely limit that. Ive watched Alan, Danny, Brett,Bob etc. win hundreds of races through the years.....I’ve seen them get beat by staying in 1 lane far too long and having someone drive around them maybe a handful of times combined. The greats have a knack of knowing when to start moving around, that ability comes with experience. “Sticks” do nothing but fast track guys with less seat time, it allows them the ability to know when to move by having someone else tell them rather than learning it. It’s a whole lot easier to see where someone should be from the grandstands, that’s why I’ve won every race I ever watched. I’m not a fan of Outside interference from crew guys with “sticks”. 

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