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How do tracks determine who is the winner in a photo finish?


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55 minutes ago, DowntheBackStretch said:

It depends on what track it is at and who the drivers are.

Got any proof of that? 

Or are you just throwing out blind accusations? 

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I've seen it at Malta before where the race officials examined each cars transponder location and then deemed the other car the winner based off that.  Think a penalty was also given due to it as well. 

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1 hour ago, jwin said:

I've been at a race that was deemed a dead heat that didn't use transponders. 

me too...... but that was over 30 yrs ago

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Today with many tracks using the transponders, a majority of these tracks use that to determine the winner. However at some tracks the scoring loop is not exactly at the start finish line, so that is a problem. At tracks where there are not transponders in use, most of the tracks go by the native eye of flagger, scorers, and anyone close to the start / finish line. I would say if you get a camera right at the start / finish line, that would work too.

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How do the actual sensor work that register the transponders? Is it under the track or closer to the flagger's stand. Because I've seen a few races I swear the other guy won but didn't and the winner was always closer to the flaggers stand and the loser always on the inside of the track. 

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7 minutes ago, Jack Brady said:

How do the actual sensor work that register the transponders? Is it under the track or closer to the flagger's stand. Because I've seen a few races I swear the other guy won but didn't and the winner was always closer to the flaggers stand and the loser always on the inside of the track. 

There is a wire "loop" buried in the track. I believe it's usually about 8' back from where the finish line is. The transponder in the car is generally mounted in the rear of the car in a standard position so that in theory the car's nose hits the finish line right when the transponder is crossing in the back of the car. That's why you see some people saying that some tracks will measure the positioning in a close finish because if Driver 1's transponder is mounted 6" ahead of where Driver 2's is, Driver 1 will show a win when he may not have won.  There used to be some diagrams for mounting in some of the rulebooks. I assume they're still there. 

There's also a good podcast episode of Open Red with Eloy G, who was I believe a nuclear physicist (or something crazy technical) who basically invented transponder scoring.  He worked full time with the Outlaws for many years. I think he was starting to train up someone else but I think he's still with the series. 

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Oftentimes, the transponder loop is ten or so feet before the flagstand, so most dead heats aren’t actually dead heats. 

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This has been an interesting topic for me. Reason being is that not only do I record the racing event, but I am also there for insurance reasons and to back up timing and scoring. From time to time, I am called into play for the other reasons.

I can't tell you how many times I watched 2 cars come down to the flagstand side by side and insisted that one car won over the other, but timing and scoring said the other did. I was hoping maybe I'd learn something.

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1 hour ago, Pinesol said:

When was the last dead heat? i know of one in 1983 I believe at Albany Saratoga.

Are you just talking modifieds? Because with all the classes tracks have these days you could have a dead heat finish more then once a night. lol

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2 hours ago, Pinesol said:

When was the last dead heat? i know of one in 1983 I believe at Albany Saratoga.

Grandview had one Saturday night. The track declared Brett Kressley the winner but people in the stands are saying it was Craig Von Doren.

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43 minutes ago, Jack Brady said:

Are you just talking modifieds? Because with all the classes tracks have these days you could have a dead heat finish more then once a night. lol

Yes, Just modifieds. Plus I am talking about co winners.

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On 6/29/2021 at 11:28 AM, ranger22 said:

Grandview had one Saturday night. The track declared Brett Kressley the winner but people in the stands are saying it was Craig Von Doren.

And Grandview just put out a realease declaring the finish a tie between Von Doren and Kressley a tie.

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On 6/29/2021 at 12:04 PM, leroy said:

LCQ 1989 Syracuse 😛

Leroy, if you were there, then you KNOW  that it 100% was not a dead heat. It was for the last qualifying spot to transfer into the Wheels 200. AJ did not qualify for that race.....it wasn’t even close. He was behind by a bare minimum of 1/2 car length .

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Yeah it was pretty stupid, Glen could of just made up a champion's provisional or some other stupid thing like press pick or something. Like they do all the time now.

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Exactly Jack ! But Glen made a big deal the previous year about him eliminating the “Press Pick”. Those that were a part of the press corps that were there reporting would always vote on a non qualified car to go into the big event. He eliminated that.

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Uncle Tom. The Press Vote at SDW under Glenn was never legit, it was who Glenn wanted in the show. If Glenn did things legit all through the years from lineups to scoring to making decisions, CNYRP would be alive and well today. 

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7 hours ago, Uncle tom said:

Leroy, if you were there, then you KNOW  that it 100% was not a dead heat. It was for the last qualifying spot to transfer into the Wheels 200. AJ did not qualify for that race.....it wasn’t even close. He was behind by a bare minimum of 1/2 car length .

I was there . It was actually the Miller High Life 300 .  AJ must of qualified.  He got the check ,the truck and trailer 😛

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